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Unsure.... And New

- - - - - allergy raw food cooked food

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13 replies to this topic

#1
AshleyHershey

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So my 4 1/2 pit/lab mix is having some food allergies. The vet isn't sure what too but with doing some elimination of foods I believe he has a grain allergy. Now I have been doing some research and some people are recommending cooking his food to eliminate any chances of bacteria in the food, but others recommend feeding it purely raw. My issue is how do I determine how much organ to give him. I know it's about 10% of his body weight but how do you determine how much it is? Secondly with the meat can I still give him quinoa, and veggies? I have read the getting started page but do you need to start them on chicken? He loves coconut oil too so I plan to continue adding that with his meal once daily. I like the idea of the already prepared stuff from nature's variety but it has no grains in it but has the meat, organs and veggie/fruit content already included. He is a huge licker and I heard through speaking with someone that if you don't give your animal pasteurized raw food then if they lick you they can cause the human to become very ill due to the levels of bacteria, with reading other forms this seems like it may be false? Just hoping for clarification.
I have never made my own food for him and wondering what materials I will need to purchase?

#2
Prey Model Raw

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Welcome!

 

Figuring out amounts of each component is based on the dog's ideal weight, energy level, age, and metabolism. Most dogs fall somewhere between 1-4% needed per day. So on average you would choose 2% of their ideal weight per day. If you could tell me how much your dog weighs I can help determine how much organ to feed. And as far as math and number crunching go- a big concept with raw feeding is that everything is approximate because all dogs are slightly different. Some can handle more than others.

 

I don't recommend feeding quinoa and veggies along with the raw meat and bone, just because this forum is not BARF based forum. We feed exclusively raw meat, bone and organ without any other additions, save for some fish oil here and there. 

 

Over the years I've seen countless people be worried about the bacteria and getting sick....I have yet to see anyone actually get sick. So, just use reasonable caution and good hygiene when prepping and feeding meals and you should be fine. That said, I don't let the dogs lick me right after eating....well, because they have what I call "yuck mouth" and it takes a while for the smell of raw food to leave! I don't think much of it past that. 

 

I also don't recommend feeding the premade stuff, just because it's processed and it's been proven that whole, fresh, raw foods are far superior to anything processed and ground.

 

If you go with feeding a raw meaty bones diet there aren't many supplies you'd need. A good freezer or two, good knives, a good pair of kitchen shears, storage containers or bags, some white vinegar for cleaning, etc. 

 

Keep the questions coming as that's the best way to learn!


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#3
Amanda

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Sometimes I give my dogs apples, watermelon, zucchini, or carrots as snacks, but this isn't very often. It's more of a seasonal treat, and they love it. But given the choice they will turn their noses up to any fruit or veggie for meat(especially organs and heart). :D



#4
Jordann

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I tried a version of the BARF diet with my boys last year, where you cook the meats. Every dog is different, but my boys didn't do well with that form. I tried it for 2 months, and their coats and attitudes completely went down hill. I also didn't like all the supplementing you have to do, because the meat was cooked. I got them back on kibble, so I could do more research on different raw options. I was afraid to try something new, but I came across this board, and was able to talk to real people who feed PMR, to ask any questions I had, right away.

My boys have been on PMR for a month now (can't believe it's been so long already!!) and the change in the boys was immediate. I have been fortunate with the boys, and they have transitioned like a dream! My larger boy has mild hip dysphasia, and has declined in playing with my other boy. Within the first 4 days, Tank began running around the yard with the other boy, Calvin. Now they play non-stop! (I know that doesn't answer any questions, but I just wanted to tell you my experiences with the two diets.)

This is a very helpful group, that has been able to answer every question I have seen posted. Welcome, and I hope you and your boy have a smooth transition!

Also, there are many articles Natalie (Prey Model Raw) has written up. I suggest reading them all. I refer to them all the time! Super helpful! There is an article about getting started, follow it! You may take longer or shorter than what is recommended, but just watch how your boy does. His body and poops will tell you when he is ready to move to the next protein.

I also suggest to take pictures of him now, so you have something to refer to, as he progresses. Don't forget those teeth! I forgot to do that, and really wish I would have gotten specific pictures, not just candids, but it still works! Great to have proof of how they are doing!
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#5
AshleyHershey

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Thank you everyone so far for their feedback. Hershey weighs about 74.5 lbs our last vet visit just about 2 weeks ago. He recently went for a TTA surgery and has recovered amazingly from it, minus the few stubborn days that he just wants to cuddle due to weather.
I guess my biggest issue with having to make my own is because I am not a fan of raw meat at all, let alone needing to handle it to prepare it for Hershey. But at the end of the day I just want my boy to be healthy and happy and not be so itchy.

I've taken time to read articles on hear but have so many concerns since there are times he doesn't chew his food very well and just inhales it. Kibble is obviously not my way anymore, but I did have him on the pasteurized food about 6 months ago when there was fear that he could have had bone cancer. So I guess now just learning how much of which he needs, especially organ meat.

Another question... He is on pasteurized right now until I can get some shopping done, do I need to fast him between the two? Or can he alternate eating the two?

#6
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What do you mean by pasteurized diet mean?

#7
Amanda

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What do you mean by pasteurized diet mean?

 

I'm guessing she probably means a processed store bought raw diet. I think they are pasteurized.



#8
AshleyHershey

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It is purchased at a local store that is already ground up that has the amount of meat/bone/muscle that is needed for the animal and you give the amount of meat that is related to the dogs size. However this is also the place that informed me that if I feed Hershey pure raw food and if he licks then he can give me salmonella by licking me at any point after he has eaten this food. But by what I have read on here it does not seem likely of this happening. I do want to put him on the pure raw food but my biggest concern is that he wont have enough of the muscle meat that he needs. I have no issues giving him raw chickens or beef, that isn't my concern by any means. I just want to be 100% positive that if I do give him raw meat that he can not spread salmonella to me.



#9
Prey Model Raw

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There's a risk contracting salmonella from lettuce from the grocery store....so, I personally just don't worry about it much at all. There is no 100% guarantee on anything in life- that includes the possibility of getting salmonella from feeding your dog a raw diet. I personally think that most cooked/processed foods still have loads of bad bacteria all over them, so you can still get infected from feeding them. 

 

If the bacteria in raw foods is just too much of an issue, maybe try a cooked, home prepared diet. 


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#10
GimMom

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I'm going to say, in the 6+ months that I have been feeding raw, I have not once gotten sick due to any bacteria. Not once. I do wash my hands after I feed, but I'm not anal about cleaning and to be honest, I haven't even gotten a cold this winter. My dog eats his dinner right off the kitchen floor, and unless he leaves chunks (which is a rarity), I don't have to clean up after him because he's licked the floor clean. I'll steam mop once a week, or just spray a little vinegar on the spot and I'm good to go. 

 

Being exposed to bacteria is not necessarily a bad thing. It helps with building immunity. It's another reason you're encouraged to have a pet when raising children, they also build up a natural immunity and are generally pretty healthy kids.

 

I have a co-worker whose mother was so worried about bacteria and germs when she was little that she went overboard on the cleaning. As a result, my co-worker was always getting sick, until her doctor told her mother to chill out. Once her mom let her do her kid thing without excessive sanitizing, she actually stopped getting sick.


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#11
taquitos

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My dog has managed (on several occasions) to lick the inside of my mouth right after having his raw meals... and I am still not sick sooo :P Not that worried about salmonella poisoning honestly.

 

The dogs are fed in their crates, and I change their bedding once a week. The cats are fed in separate rooms (one in the dining/living room on the dinner table, the other in the bathroom, and the last in the office), and they usually get meat/blood on the surfaces on which they are eating (they like to pull their food out of the bowls and eat them). I just do a quick wipe down with Dr Bronner's mixed with water, and I haven't had issues.

 

I have heard it being said that you are more likely to catch salmonella from your own bathroom that from your raw fed pets :)

 

Obviously just don't be unhygienic about it -- wash your hands after handling the meat, and take the same procedures you take when cooking your own meat.


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#12
AshleyHershey

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Completely understandable and just wanted to be sure, I know one of the leading causes of salmonella is actually spinach.

But anyways now that that is completely cleared up, he is currently on food from Primal Raw food, chicken formula, but he is still reacting and am almost to the point that I may have to get allergy tests done because it doesn't matter what he eats his poor belly gets hives and is bright red. I will remember to take a picture tomorrow when I feed him to post so you have an idea what my poor boy goes through.

So after reading many blogs it tells me to start with chicken. Can I start with chicken leg quarters instead of backs and is it 1 twice a day? Not sure how often I am suppose to feed him.



#13
Jordann

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When I started my boys, I couldn't find chicken backs for under $2 a lb (too high in my opinion), so I got the boys started on chicken quarters ($.69 a lb). For my boys, that was enough (on the verge of a little too much) bone. Every dog is different, though. It is suggested you start with backs, as they have such a high bone content, and bone is a constipating agent, which you want when you first switch, as their bodies are getting used to the new food.

Could it be environmental allergies for your boy?

#14
Prey Model Raw

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Chicken quarters are fine- just make sure to trim excess skin and fat off before feeding in the beginning, eventually getting to the point of feeding whole, untrimmed quarters.

Keep us posted!





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